Will we be more vocal as gay men if Trans men start demanding we sleep with them?

My earlier post asking other gay men to really take up the issue of our lesbian sisters being called “bigots” by trans women(M2T) for not sexually or romantically engaging with them. Step back and look closer: Heterosexual Males ganging up on lesbian women for not sleeping with them. Males who hold an ideology that their power of “identity” can transcend most physical realities, and as such they are as much a valid lesbian as a born female lesbian, and if this falls into question with a female born lesbian she is a transphobic bigot.

Quite a few people have made mention of my focus seemingly solely on trans women. Because of this they like to call me a “transmisogynist” in lieu of just plain ole “transphobic”. Don’t worry though, I get that too. The focus on trans women over trans men(F2T) is due primarily for two reasons. The first being that trans women are by far the more aggressive people in these two categories reguarlly attacking and slandering women, specifically lesbians, in a constant manner. Get online, see what’s happening.
Because They are serving as the aggressors in this situation by imposing on women who wish to be left alone and are entitled to their views, they by far have the most visibility.  The second reason is I don’t particularly feel it appropriate to have many of the conversations I would have with a Trans woman with a Trans man, who would be better suited to speak to females, and be called out by females and not by a male. The only time I would feel it appropriate to have that conversation with a trans man would be if this trans man was claiming a gay male identity, and like what transwomen are doing, go on a rampage against gay men who understand what homosexual means.

So, lets have this hypothetical conversation to help put things in perspective for gay men who are setting on the fence about this issue.  I feel like many of us are skeptical to actually dive into the issue, full throttle, both feet in, because we have pity for Trans women. We can, in part relate to their struggle, but we are judging them by their perceived shared oppression and not by their content or their narrative. We are not addressing the trans/queer ideology that the community is bathing in, and how deeply homophobic this is.  So the hypothetical is this: Gay males are bombarded by trans men activist who are trying to both wedge their way into gay spaces and culture, and who are ready to shame and demand on the topic of linking up romantically or sexually with bio gay men if those men stand their ground that the word “homosexual” actually means something. Once more with feeling: HomoSEXual.  Your “gender expression” means nothing to us. We are HomoSEXuals not HomoGENDERuals.

gays

So, lets say this is actually happening to gay men. That every time we log on to our social media accounts we are accosted with insults “Prick, bigot, Cis, transphobe, fetishist” etc. Because we have made it public that we are homosexual and we know that word has meaning. Would big gay organizations take notice then? Or go along with the trans narrative and then we could be dubbed some weird acronym male equivalent of “TERF”. I doubt we would be going along with heterosexual women claiming to be gay guys demanding we sleep with them to affirm them as male. Now I say this is all hypothetical, It’s not, it’s quickly becoming a reality and these conversations are growing in the queer community about how horrible homosexuals are. All of us, but with the most intense focus being on lesbians. Soon I’m predicting we will see more of a push from the trans community against the gay male segment of the population with the progression of this becoming accepted in community circles. And how self serving will the outcry be then? Lesbians are homosexuals, they have my support and they should have yours. Any self respecting gay man would support a lesbians right to be a homosexual without shame.

There will be some men in the gay community who will side with the trans ideology, as there are some women in the lesbian community that do as well. This is unfortunate because it seemingly validates what is happening in the minds of some people. I am totally prepared and willing to play the true scotsman game here. No TRUE homosexual man will be romantic or sleep with a trans man because what he would be doing by doing that is engaging in a heterosexual activity, being intimate with a biological female. This is not the definition of homosexual.  Words have meanings, homosexual is one of those words. I know what it means , and so do many of us gay men and lesbians out there. We know what we are, we are homosexuals. we know what they are not, and they are not us.
Heterosexual trans appropriation of our history and future is very much a threat.

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59 thoughts on “Will we be more vocal as gay men if Trans men start demanding we sleep with them?

      • Just watching your interview, it’s great to see how this line has grown in reach. I think IF we at some point reach peak-trans* this line will have played a big role. There is no stronger argument or more relatable argument. Keep up the good work.

    • I like that line too! I am not attracted to gender because it is an oppressive social construct designed to oppress females and reinforce male supremacy. I am only attracted to other women and so I am a homoSEXual.

  1. dear tnt666: That was a good way to put it 🙂

    Regarding this pieae. Thank you for writing this. I’m happy to see gay men taking this up. It’s not such a big problem that transmen would try and do it. I’ve heard some case in Toronto in which a gay man was harassed by a transman (and followers) for refusing to sleep with her (the transman). But other than that it’s been pretty quite. It’s mainly a problem from males onto females, no surprise there considering the culture we all live in.
    But anyway. Thank you for this important post.

    • The trans issues are just now seeming to start to trickle into the the gay male population, I’m predicting more to come. Give it 20 years. thank you so much for reading!

  2. Very interesting to read ! I think gay men know what they like, sexually speaking : it’s not a V, and they wouldn’t listen too long if someone told them that they can be attracted to a “male vulva”. It’s nice to consider the whole personality of a person and everything, but nicer to respect each one’s “mechanic of attraction”, something trans-women don’t do with lesbians. (I’m a hetero woman’ but feel for lesbians currently, cause feminism I guess) I was reading this thread in the Datalounge about Avery Edison, reactions are quite interesting . http://www.datalounge.com/cgi-bin/iowa/ajax.html?t=13674182#page:showThread,13674182

  3. I don’t think women will feel entitled enough to demand sex with gay men because they’re not raised to think the world revolves around them, watching hero movies and “chosen one” TV shows like straight men do. Women are taught to lay low and not to expect much of life instead.

    • I agree. The reason M2T’s are doing it is because of male entitlement and socialization. I do think we are moving towards something similar(perhaps not as forceful.) happening as time goes on though. Trans theory is big with the kids.

  4. Except it isn’t going to happen, because FTMs were socialized as women. The sense of entitlement that MTFs have towards women’s bodies is the exactly the same sense of entitlement exhibited by men everywhere. Women (even those that imagine themselves to be men) do not typically become enraged when men refuse to have sex with them.

  5. You seem yo know your LGBT lingo very well. Have you ever heard the term GenderQueer? Pansexual? Pangender? Look these up, fit them into this small ideological box you have built and then get back to me with a real opinion on the world and the people that live on it.

      • Absolutely nothing I would like to say. There are so many forms of homophobia today esp. within the left that claims to be so “righteous and good”. At least with the right they say out loud they don’t like homosexuals (so it’s easy to spot them and fight them) but within the left they really want to sneak and hide that they don’t like homosexuals, because too many people and their sexualities and ideologies, homosexuals is the wall they can never penetrate, the very sexuality that overthrows their anti-biology crap or whatever delusional thing they have made up in their minds.

  6. I’m a lot more worried about women being driven out of battered women’s shelters and rape crisis centers by trans-cis-men than I am about women being importuned for sex by these cis.men (“cis” that’s their made-up word to degrade and marginalize authentic women). For over a decade now transcismen have been infiltrating battered women’s shelters and rape crisis services and sexually harassing women, threatening them physically or with lawsuits and trying to install themselves in positions of power.
    http://thetyee.ca/News/2007/02/03/Nixon/
    Women are constantly pressured by men for sex, and have been collectively and singly guilt-tripped, drugged, raped and tricked into sexual activities. It’s a constant problem for hetro and lesbian women. Nothing new there. If only you had acknowledged all women, no matter their sexual orientation, suffer from this threat and how often it’s realized. But you don’t. Instead you make this coercion objectionable only when it applies to a segment of women; to render it exceptionalism, rather than a mainstream experience for women. The old divisionary tactic that denies the universality of women’s oppression or reduces it to non-existence by positing it’s only a problem for some subgroups or minorities within the broader category rather than a generic problem for women (i.e. There is no problem of sexism). Yet, you call yourself a “feminist” I wouldn’t call any man a feminist, but I surely acknowledge and am grateful to sincerely egalitarian men who are anti-sexist activists.
    While women generally have been the most supportive segment of the population for gay rights, in contrast, for years I’ve observed how the gay patriarchy ridicules and degrades women’s and feminist aspirations; whether by the constant use of the “B” word, or by the money man for gay marriage, Peter Thiel, stating that he’s disappointed women got the vote since democracy, for him, will now be impossible. All this, and so much more, without a murmur of protest from the gay community, just a relentless parody of women as limp-wristed, shallow, petty, stupid, and jealous, with whining post-debutante drawls – a portrayal which isn’t confined to drag queens, but also written into T.V. roles for women by men like Michael Patrick King, et al. They don’t think we women get it – that this is what they think of us. We see this “mimicry” also acted out by transcismen. It would be nice to see some resistance and rebellion instead of indifference to this oblivious misogyny in the gay community. But I’m not holding my breath.
    The whole thing about men pretending to be women is so outrageously absurd I can hardly believe I’m spending time on refuting it. While scientifically speaking, there is no such thing as “race” in the genome, only cultural and ethnic influences on people, there are certainly sex traits in the genome.

    • I think you bring up some really interesting points . I focused on homosexuals here because I’m a homosexual, so are lesbians. I have many other issues with the current social shift and dynamic trans women are imposing on females, I defend women only space, that most definitely includes shelters or rape crisis centers. I haven’t made that a focus point here on my blog though, which is true.
      I’ve never once have referred to myself as “feminist” So I don’t know where that is coming from.

      • why are you NOT a feminist? Feminism has a lot of different branches, but he main one i sthat women should be equal to men, do you think women should be below men/the property of men?

      • I consider myself to be pro-feminist. “feminist” is a title I feel that belongs exclusively to female people. Do I think women should be below or property of men? Never. In fact for the future I’d say a changing of the guard looks pretty good. Men have fucked up.

  7. Queer and mainstream trans politics are so incredibly toxic and homophobic and it’s very disappointing that it’s viewed as the gospel truth. Apparently now sexual orientation has nothing to do with attraction to one or both biological sexes, but instead has to do with being attracted to genderfeels and an identity in someone’s head. Oh, and you can change your sexual orientation with magical thinking and are expected to because not being attracted to someone’s identity is bigotry. You must have sex with these rapey assholes to validate them.

    This is no different from the same old lesbophobia us lesbians have heard from straight men since forever, but it’s hidden beneath fancy meaningless language and it’s more toxic because it comes from within the community.

    I thank you for calling out this garbage. I utterly despise people who equate “someone wouldn’t sleep with me” with a serious issue like systematic oppression. As for trans men harassing gay men, I haven’t seen that much of it, but wouldn’t be surprised if it exists. It could be less common because trans men are biologically female and therefore weren’t socialized with a male entitlement complex.

    • That’s a big one for me for why I’m less than supportive of transactivism.

      No one is obligated to validate anything about you. A transwoman would do best trying to find bisexual women or “flexible” straight women to have sex with, but presumably getting lesbians to acknowledge them as being “real” women is the prize they seek.

      So much of this is about validation, not legal rights, not some basic acknowledgment that transpeople deserve to be able to do what they want free of harassment, violence, and overt hatred. That’s what I used to think transrights were about, but, as it’s been moving toward trying to force the rest of us to treat transwomen with penises as full women, my support has waned. Don’t try to dictate to me how I’m “allowed” to perceive you.

      • Exactly! If it was more about legal rights (and they have to be legal rights that AREN’T at the expense of females/women) then I’m for it. But it is more about validation and entitlement. Plus, I think the reason they target lesbians and women instead of, say the men who commit violent crimes against them is because women, particularly lesbians are easy targets. If there was more of this rapey bullshit directed at gay men, or especially straight men, their movement would be out of here.

        Personally I’m completely done with post-modernist queer and trans politics and their toxicity. Not to mention, I’m a scientist, and yet I’m supposed to go along with the idea that the penis is a female sex organ and the vagina is a male sex organ? Yeah right. (Though that argument about vaginas is not as common.) If biology hurts your feelings, it’s not my problem.

      • You nailed it with that post.
        This is the problem in a nutshell, the validation. To make anyone around them do a “make believe”, a faith based assumption that they are what they say they are, despite your eyes and lived experience says otherwise.

  8. http://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2014/04/11/dana-mccallum-male-senior-twitter-programmer-and-self-proclaimed-transgender-woman-charged-with-three-felony-counts-of-rape/

    Look what happens to women who dare to blog about criminal trans women. The owner of this blog got her account frozen. Another disgusting thing is that the people siding with the rapist are insisting that “she” is a “lesbian”. Bullshit! This is male on female violence not female on female.

    • That blog may be unfrozen now, but yeah that’s what happens. I agree it’s bullshit. That is not a lesbian rapist; that is a male rapist. Lesbians don’t have dicks! When it comes to violent crime, I think the birth sex of the perpetrator is more relevant than identity, especially if they haven’t undergone SRS.

      I’m disgusted that people care more about respecting the rapist’s “identity” than about the fact that he’s a rapist! You’d think that they’d want to condemn this person and not associate with him, but no. And then trans people who condemn that behavior get a lot of hate from either the trans jacktivists or their ally-cookie-seeking jacktivist brigade.

  9. I’m a trans man, “heterogender/homosexual” in your terminology (I like women). Will give my opinion though.

    You seem to be missing that not everybody who defines themselves as “homosexual” is aware of this strict definition. Transgender wasn’t such a known issue until recently, and many people haven’t even meet a transgender person in their life. So they called themselves homosexual, because they felt attracted to men – that’s the cis men they have met (or they thought were cis men). Some of them might have felt also attracted to trans men, but since they haven’t met any, they don’t know.

    So there’s a probability that some people who identify themselves as “homosexual” are actually “homogender”.

    Besides of that, I agree that we are different and should leave to each person to decide if they like us or not, instead of forcing ourselves in a group. I’m also relatively sure that the problem will always be more pronounced in the world transwomen/ciswomen than trans men/men, since we trans men, probably due to our oppressive female socialisation are not so needy and pushy (to call it in a nice way). And also because pushing on cis-women is probably easier and more fun than pushing on cis-men. It totally noticeable already – besides the significantly higher visibility of trans women in the media, there’s also this huge deal with “TERF”, on the other side though, there’s not even a name for men who don’t accept trans men in their circles (or I haven’t come across yet – but I have seen TERF already like 1 million times in Twitter).

    • Small correction – I’m only “heterogender”, not “heterogender/homosexual” since I don’t discard the possibility to be attracted to a trans woman (which hasn’t happened yet, but who knows).

  10. I’m female to make trans and I agree 150%.

    I get so much hate from my own “community” over this. This isn’t an anti trans rant.

    The t in LGBTQ needs to be removed simply because lgbq are SEXUAL identities.

    Not gender expressions.

    Like my friend tom says “I didn’t start talking to gay men for dates until I had bottom surgery. Why? Because I get the fact that gay men like dick. And I didn’t have one until now.”

  11. Pushing aside the fact that you’re wording implies you don’t believe a transgender person is truly the gender they identify as – because I can see when some debates are hopeless.

    I’m a transguy, but I don’t expect a bio gay guy to be okay with sleeping with me. You can’t expect anyone to just be okay sleeping with you, trans or not. It’s just a case of whether things click and you both decide to try. I don’t think being with a trans persons can make someone less gay/lesbian either.

    I get that you are making a point about the physical bodies, but don’t completely ignore mentality. Afterall personality is kind of a big factor when choosing to date someone. Some gay guys like masculine guys, some like feminine ones.

    I don’t know about the comments of transwomen who take advantage of other women. I’m pretty sure it’s the minority. It doesn’t justify it in any way, but like with any group, we have bad people and good people.

    • I don’t think anyone would claim that personality don’t matter regarding attraction. However homosexuality, bisexuality and heterosexuality are all sexualities, not gender based. These are just the core on what a person would have for criteria to feel sexually attracted to someone.
      If you are heterosexual you simply don’t feel sexually attracted to others that share your sex, if you are homosexual you don’t feel sexual attraction to the opposite sex, if you are bisexual you can feel sexual attraction no matter if the one you feel attracted to is male or female.

      However, no one is saying (at least not here as far as I can see) that mentality don’t matter. Your sexuality is not all that matters, its just the foundation upon who you would find sexual arousal towards and not but of course personality comes into play and also your own personal biological preferences comes into play. What I mean by personal biological preferences is like some like green eyes, others would prefer blue eyes, one can like short hair, long hair, different skin tones and so on and so forth, there are probably as many variations on what is attractive as there are human beings on the planet (even if our society really is working overtime to narrow it down and make stereotypical images of what we shall be attracted to and not using porn culture, beauty culture and so on and so forth)
      Anyway who you feel sexual attraction to is a combination of biology and mentality/personality working in tandem.

    • Trans folks have their own definitions of words which do not coincide with any dictionary. The “mentality” this transperson is referring to has nothing to do with personality. Mentality, in trans talk refers to the mental concept of themselves as a member of the opposite sex.

      It is easy to get drawn into the trans agenda and their incredible way of distorting words and concepts for their own needs.

  12. I like where you are going with this dialogue. I wish Gay men would be a little more verbal and reinforce that sexual orientation is defined by sex (i.e. biological birth sex) over “gender identity”. I do understand why Gay men don’t want to alienate Trans women (because they really are a unique subset of Gay men). As far as Trans men, they are the same species as RadFems lesbians, only they too are “in denial” about it and pursue “straight sex with other women”. The reason that Trans men aren’t attacking “TERF”s is because RadFems are ignoring them as a non-hostile group of lesbians that have a disconnect with their female essence. Whereas the Trans woman is continually trying to redefine womanhood as being something other than the usual,having a uterus, ovaries, ability to become pregnant, to be made subservient to males,etc. The only thing remotely female about Trans women is their love of dresses and makeup and high heels, which the Rad Fem rejects like a bad allergic reaction. I think the Gay and Lesbian community shouldn’t cater to the “straight” delusions of Trans*. If Trans can’t love themselves for who they are, there’s something wrong with it (i.e. it is escapism from inner Gay reality and hatred of one’s self, the denial of one’s own birth sex.

  13. Amazed at the people who think that pointing out that people can be something other than just gay or straight, or identify with a gender something outside of the binary, disproves everything said here. OHHH we had NEVER heard the term “pansexual” before. Holy shit. I mean… god. How embarrassing.

    If you’re a “gay” male who is sexually interested in trans men, you are bi or pansexual, not gay. However, gay men can be attracted to any male-bodied trans people including transwomen and AMAB nonbinary.
    If you’re a “gay” female who is sexually interested in trans women, you are bi or pansexual, not gay. However, gay women can be attracted to any female-bodied trans people including transmen and AFAB nonbinary.

    Its really not that difficult of a concept.

    Anyway. What a funny coincidence that so far the people born with dicks and raised as people-with-dicks are behaving far more aggressively and with much more violence and entitlement than people-with-vaginas. Who could’ve thought that male socialization and privilege is present even in non-straight, non-white, or even gender non-conforming individuals. Its almost like… you can be oppressed on one axis while still retaining plenty of privilege on others. Woah. Weird!

    • That’s simple really, because being born with a penis is the absolute and ultimate privilege in this world. Patriarchy is the oldest religion. I prefer saying dicks sleep with dicks/vaginas/both, or vaginas sleep with dicks/vaginas/both. All the other terminology leaves me cold… because they are all changeable on a whim.

  14. wtf I thought they were females trapped in male bodies, why do they need to learn how female act? lol
    the transsexual delusion

  15. The topic of this article confuses me. So, your saying that it’s wrong for a transman to pursue a relationship with a bio gay male, and likewise for transwomen with bio female lesbians. Soooo, do gay men date transwomen? Do lesbians date transmen? What if a transguy was attracted to men? Should he try to pursue a relationship with a straight bio male? Or if a transwoman is attracted to women, should she try to pursue a relationship with a straight bio female? How would they define their sexualities in that case? Are they all straight? Or maybe you think transpeople should only pursue relationships and date other transpeople cuz of … umm … “ick” or something? 😛

    I mean, personally, I’ve never met a gay man who dated transwomen before, and I hadn’t ever considered trying to date a gay guy since from what I assume he likes dating men not women. This is just confusing The guys I date have all identified as either straight or bi, and they find me, my personality, and my body attractive, and there is never any issue at all about their consideration of me as a woman. /shrug

    So here’s a scenario as it plays out in my life: Sometimes I meet a guy, maybe at a bar or through my circle of friends or at the grocery store or gym or something. We hit it off and I can tell he’s into me. He asks me out, I give him my number, yada yada. It’s usually after he calls/texts/messages me that I spill the beans about my medical history, etc. A lot of the time guys don’t really care. There’s a lot more info out there nowadays, and girls like me might be few-and-far-between, but it’s certainly not as big a deal as it once was. However, there are also the guys who are surprised by the information and let me know up front that they think I’m nice and that I’m pretty but that they don’t think it would work out because of, ya know, “it”. lol Now in those situations, I would never ever be like “what’s wrong with you!? how could you say that?! I’m a woman, and if you like women, then you should still want to date me!!” That would just be dumb and childish. I might be a little let down and my feelings my even be a little hurt, but I’m an adult and I can handle rejection if it comes my way. I usually just tell him thanks anyways, and that if we run into eachother again maybe we could be friends.

    I would HOPE that this kind of situation is how things would go with the lesbian/gay community. If a gay man is attracted to a transman but after learning he is trans decides it’s “not his thing” then just be open and honest about it. No need to attack his lifestyle or identity, and no need to feel like your sexual identity is being attacked in any way. And I would hope he would respect you and your preferences as well.

    I don’t know, just sharing my thoughts on the issue. -With Love ❤

  16. Anyone else that gets very uncomfortable when people make claims about who is and isn’t a “true” homosexual? Can’t everyone stop accusing each other and accept that some gay people care more about the gender than the sex, and some more about the sex than the gender. Both groups are “allowed” to self-identify with the word homosexual. Oh, and that goes for straight people too.
    We’re all different in taste and flavour and words doesn’t cover all of the human behaviours, so let’s not criticize each other’s for the choice of words. Everyone is entitled to decide how to identify – lesbians dating transgirls as well as cis gay guys who date other cis gayguys.

      • I meant that those heterosexuals who care mor for the gender than the sex and are open to date a transgirl, are equally “allowed” to call themselves heterosexuals as those who don’t date transgirls.

        But as you describe transmen as straight women I guess there’s not much of a point to discuss with you…

  17. Reblogged this on FeistyAmazon and commented:
    I couldn’t agree more with this. One day …when gay men wake up they will figure out the trans movement is not their friend..and some ARE waking up as FTMs want into THEIR intimate sex and community gay male spaces. But this is one of the first gay men GETTING Lesbian oppression in all this. We are communities under siege…and we ARE NOT PANSEXUAL.

  18. Actually, you are a transphobic bigot. Don’t flatter yourself. You’re just another pawn of the patriarchy, carrying out its desire to see trans people and their identities erased. You are no different from monsters like Ken Zucker, who abused young people in an attempt to make them into gay men rather than trans women..and that’s no better than the Christians who advocate identical reparative therapy to abuse gays and lesbians.

    But of course, gays and lesbians are waiting for their ‘officially approved’ stamp from the patriarchy; they think they’ve just about got it, and I mean, Marriage Equality! You might actually have cracked it… while trans people…well, let’s be honest now, as far as you’re concerned they’re just a bunch of freaks holding you back.

    The patriarchy might be able to accommodate gays and lesbians, as long as you conform to certain behavioural and identity rules — the most stringent of which is ‘only ever dress and behave as your birth sex would indicate, according to the styles approved of by the patriarchy in your particular place and time.’

    It’s a rare day that I hate to be vindicated, but here in the dank and stinking recesses of the gay and lesbian underbelly, I have been. I’ve been saying for years that a huge section of the mainstream LG (you hate Bs as well, do try to be honest for once) utterly detests trans people for two reasons: you think that association with them will prevent your assimilation into the patriarchy, which is what you want, so you can gain privilege and lord it over others; and transgender identities challenge at root the invented gay identities that first appeared in the US only a few decades ago. Hey, what about if ‘gay’ men don’t really exist? What about if they’re actually all women pretending to be men in order to sneak under the patriarchy’s radar? And could the same be true of lesbians? Holy shit Batgirl, don’t tell anyone! And here you all are proving it. Maybe a touch of TERFism in there along with the blatant transphobia? Thought as much.

    Thing is, trans people have been around for many thousands of years and they will not be going away because they don’t fit with a bunch of privileged white people’s master plan. You barking up the wrong tree.

    One final point: I think Huckabee, Santorum et al are first-grade delusionals and I don’t agree with anything they say, but here’s a thing: I really don’t believe they’d be selling their friends and allies down the river just to gain a bit of political purchase, or saying how much they support people with one side of their mouths while out of the other they’re talking about them ‘colonising bodies’ and ‘invading spaces’…You know why? It’s cause they may be shits, but they are shits with integrity. You got a long way to go before you get there.

    You can thank me for the heads up another time.

  19. Actually, you are a transphobic bigot. Don’t flatter yourself. You’re just another pawn of the patriarchy, carrying out its desire to see trans people and their identities erased. You are no different from monsters like Ken Zucker, who abused young people in an attempt to make them into gay men rather than trans women..and that’s no better than the Christians who advocate identical reparative therapy to abuse gays and lesbians.”

    Hi Mr. Flemming,

    Can you tell me how pointing out that biological differences exist in sexually dimorphic species like homo sapiens makes one a transphobic bigot? Or pointing out that there is a movement aimed at calling lesbians and gay men (homoSEXuals) bigots ( You are free to research The Cotton Ceiling as it was also referenced in the blog post.) for not being sexually or romantically interested in Trans people. Also I have never EVER advocated any kind of “correctional” therapy for trans individuals, so your comparison of me to Ken Tucker is ridiculous hyperbole, much like most of your “argument”, if you could call it that. Respond to my words, not my character, which really you know nothing of, don’t pretend.

  20. You know, I used to have a teacher who said ‘people who can’t be bothered to spell your name correctly are not worthy of your consideration.’ That would fit in with the passive-aggressive tone of your response. But since you ask, and I’m a nice guy, here’s a few examples. From your own words.

    ‘No TRUE homosexual man will be romantic or sleep with a trans man’ — transphobic and sexist reductivism. You reduce people to genitalia, just as the patriarchy does.

    ‘trans ideology’ — I see, transgender is an ‘ideology’ now while being ‘gay’ is what? Let me tell you: it’s a politically-constructed Identity that didn’t exist till the 1950s. Pure transphobia.

    ‘Heterosexual trans appropriation of our history’ — So what you are saying is that if a trans man is attracted to a man, then he is actually a woman pretending to be a man? So you, in all you glorious ‘gayness’, just eradicate trans Identity? Transphobia. And your ‘history’ goes back all of what, 50 years? While trans history goes back to Sumer. If anyone is appropriating it’s you.

    ‘we have pity for Trans women.’ — Do you though? Patronising as well as transphobic. New Gay Men have been muscling in on trans women since before Stonewall — begun by trans women of colour, appropriated by privileged white New Gay Men — like you. But you have ‘pity’ for the people whose Identity you have been trying — and continue to try — to eradicate, in the name of the patriarchy and the seething misogyny that motivates you.

    Best for last: — ‘(Trans women are) Heterosexual Males … who hold an ideology that their power of “identity” can transcend most physical realities’ So for you, trans identities don’t exist and everyone is just what the patriarchy says they are. Born with a dick = man. That’s rich coming from someone whose Identity didn’t even exist 6 decades ago.

    Let’s be clear here. You adopt a constructed Identity that was invented in America some 60 years ago. Trans people, especially trans women, have been recorded since the beginning of writing itself, over 5000 years ago in Sumer. They exist all over the world and have done ever since, whereas the New Gay Man — that would be you — was conjured into existence into the 20th century. So you dare to attempt to eradicate an Identity that may well be as old as human culture itself in favour of your political convenience. Well, I don’t mind you having this delusional ‘Identity’; it’s your right. Do try to remember who was here first and stop pissing all over them though.

    And by the way, remember who your misogyny helps the most — the patriarchy. Oh but dang I forgot — the only reason the New Gay Man identity exists at all is so you can sneak under the patriarchy’s radar and get some of that sweet privilege. And if you have to misgender, insult and disenfranchise trans people on the way, well, that’s what guys in the patriarchy do, isn’t it?

  21. Hi, I see your point. I understand your point. Homosexual means that you are attracted to the same sex as you are. But as I reading your post and comments, I realise that you also saying that transgender people in reality don’t exist. They just “gay” or “straight” or “lesbian”. Because I am a transguy, I probably can never have a relationship, because for a gay guy I have a vagina and for a straight guy I act too masculine (including pronouns, names, clothes and behaviour). That is fine. As I said, I understand your concerns. But all I ask you is to allows transgender people live as their indentified gender. I rather die than live as a woman. There is no other option. In reality death is the only painless option there is. All I ask is to unknowledge that we are the gender we indentified as and use the correct names and pronouns. That is how simple it is. If not, just kill us. That is the best you can do in that case.

    • “I rather die than live as a woman. There is no other option. In reality death is the only painless option there is. All I ask is to unknowledge that we are the gender we indentified as and use the correct names and pronouns. That is how simple it is. If not, just kill us. That is the best you can do in that case.”

      If you’re in anyway suicidal I strongly encourage you to reach out and get help. As for the rest of your argument- do as you please…but you can’t expect the rest of us to buy into your identity over your reality.

  22. ‘oppressed’ online and systematically oppressed, yknow, in REAL LIFE, are two incredibly different things. nobody would wanna fuck you anyways, whoiscis. you’re fucking ugly from the inside out.

    • Oh you’re argument is just so heavy. I’m not saying anything that’s off the wall. I’ve been discriminated against for most of my life because I’m sexually attracted to other biological males. You’re here to tell me that biology doesn’t exist and doesn’t matter. NO. I’m not humoring that nonsense.

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